Talk:Directory of the shops of Caledon

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The best place for advertising businesses is the Steamlander forums. Character back-story pages which reference in-world businesses in the various 3D worlds are fine. Pages of links to external sites, and especially focusing on commercial enterprises in one community in one virtual world should be added very judiciously and in such as way as does not directly compete with the paid advertising services offered to members by Steampunk Island Inc., who donates the server resources for this wiki. --SteampunkWiki Engineer 21:08, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Hi! Is it OK to keep the Caledon shop directory on the Wiki, or does it fall into the category of disallowed advertising? I would really like to see a shop directory show up somewhere on the Web, and a wiki would be perfect, but I don't want to run afoul of the rules. Maybe another website would be better suited? It wasn't quite clear to me where I might discuss the possibility first, so I put it up there under the theory that, on Wikis, one should sin boldly. --Samm Florian 04:36, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

You created a page that consisted primarily of a listing of a duplicate listing of sims in a Second Life micronation, with what amounts to business advertising interspersed. I edited out the empty sim listings and made the comment on the talk page for that that wiki pages are an inappropriate place for advertising and your response was to create the page *again* under a new name (but with the same content edited the first time) and to create a talk page for this wiki curator instead of here, on the talk page which I had already started explaining to you why the page was edited. It is especially odd that you did so considering you refer to my remarks on advertising on this talk page (I have moved your comment here to this talk page since it addresses the subject under discussion). If you simply create more duplicate pages of the same content you are spamming the wiki and your account will be locked from further editing. The wiki is *not* a place for you to post free advertising. --SteampunkWiki Engineer 15:12, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
OK, I was a moron for not checking the discussion page here before responding to you; in my (very very weak) defense, the color scheme makes it difficult to tell real links from broken links, so I didn't know a discussion page existed. I also am making too many assumptions about how this wiki works, and I apologize for that. It was always my impression, on Wikipedia at least, that one sends messages directly to other contributors via their discussion pages, and that one can use subdirectories of one's own page as a private workspace, which is where I put the page duplicate.
What I want to see, somewhere, is a moderately complete listing of the shops in Caledon, which can be updated by shopowners and other residents. The forums are not good for this because there is no sorting and entries cannot be edited when a store goes out of business. A wiki is ideal, and that's what I was trying to set up. It wasn't meant to be spam-- I don't own any shops.
That said, if the powers-that-be here don't think it's appropriate, go ahead and take it down and I won't recreate it. My sincerest apologies for the confusion. --Samm Florian 15:46, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
One problem with entering a full list of sims in a particular estate, is that it will create a need to update that list periodically on this page as well as other places where they are all listed. I have removed the lists of sims with no shops entered, but left the actual information about the 3 shops which you entered (and edited the external link to SLURL since that allows a reader to directly "teleport" to the location "in-world" using a version or derivative of the Second Life client, where the mapping link requires additional clicks). Another problem is that of potentially encouraging use of the wiki as an advertising resource versus an encyclopedic reference.
It might make more sense to include mentions of noteworthy shops in individual sim pages, or if we are to do a directory of shops, do an alphabetical listing which informatively mentions the shop (perhaps a wiki link to the sim and/or micronation and/or 3D world where it exists). This should be done judiciously and with some discussion of style and format, to ensure that the wiki remains primarily a reference resource for the genre of Steampunk. --SteampunkWiki Engineer 18:01, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
I admire Miss Florian's pluck and agree that generally the Wiki is robust enough to handle bold errors and rollbacks. I also readily understand Our Host's wariness regards advertisements of a single community in a single grid Herein. What I'm hearing in 'text' is Our Host straddling an awkward line between informative resource for exploring Steampunk and 'classified ad space'. I've been certain that Steampunk communities in Any Grid really need to get the word out in a more organized fashion regards fun product they offer. While my natural thought (as Miss Florian's apparently) was to do that HERE, I sense it is really against the grain and possibly (at some future unwieldy point) something that would be taken down (or drift from Strict Intent).
As such, I propose a money making project for Our Host. Give the forum (where proper merchant advertisements are welcomed) some sort of Wiki Merchant Catalog sideroom where a source of funding combines with a lively mapping of Commercial SLURLs for Steampunk content. Really there is nothing like it and the Current Merchant Forum is nice (I'm one of the few that tries to use it often) but not robust and generates what sort of traffic? It would be marvelous to see the 'Steampunk Shopkeepers Selections' become a reason for folks to discover the Forum. -- Darlingmonster Ember 15:29, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
Not a bad idea. It is to allow greater flexibility (without needless extra blood, sweat, and tears) that we are undertaking a redesign and full re-write of the site as an integrated portal rather than a mish-mash of open source projects held together with chewing gum and bailing wire. While MediaWiki (wiki) and phpBB (forums) would be tough acts to follow, this engineer believes it will be worth the effort to write original code rather than repeatedly having to dive in and master the work of teams of other programmers. --SteampunkWiki Engineer 04:07, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
As the other (non-commercial) competitor in the "getting the word out about shopping" category, it's a spur to do something about expanding the Victorian Shopkeepers Association beyond an announcement list. I made a half-baked blog, but a proper url with associated wiki would really make a lot of sense. (Now if I can just figure out what the handy code to sign my comment is!) Otenth Paderborn 01:02, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Excellent! If you do it as a wiki we can interwiki to there from here. --SteampunkWiki Engineer 16:33, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Good Gentles, may I direct your attention to a further dimension of our discussion? SLURLS and prims and shops tied together so that the system updates itself over in Babbage. M Paderborn may be very interested to speak to M Aeolus Cleanslate. Darlingmonster Ember 16:48, 6 January 2011 (UTC)